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"Things got progressively worse for all of us. The children kept getting anemic in spite of all my best raw efforts."
FAMILY DEVELOPED SERIOUS DEFICIENCY ON RAW VEGAN/FRUITARIAN DIET
- WHAT IS THE BEST RECOVERY FROM "natural hygienic" PROBLEM-DIETS?
Make certain you are knowledgeable before going on an all-plant diet with children! Raw or not.
Note: All-raw & non-toxic diets are usually super-healthy, except for deficient diets = mainly "long-term" vegan/fruitarian diets.
WHAT WAS THE REAL PROBLEM?
Below is an email from a natural hygienist with children, who all got in trouble on a raw vegan/fruitarian diet = 100% all-raw & all-plant diet.
And they still were in trouble in 5-08, despite combined efforts from conventional & alternative specialists.
This family obviously thought that "raw" was their main problem. The mother calls their story "OUR JOURNEY TO RAW AND BACK".
This is an error according to INHS, since "raw" is not the problem. A "cooked" vegan/fruitarian diet is often worse.
Again, the problem is NOT "all-raw" --- the problem is "long-term vegan/fruitarian".
"All-plant" is a problem, long-term. (Short-term it is fine, e.g. excellent for health recovery.)
Too much fruit is a problem.
Too little animal foods is a problem, long-term.
All-raw is fine, an optimal diet choice. (There are a few exceptions.)
WHY DID THEY THINK THE DIET WAS HEALTH-PROMOTING?
Over time, several branches of NH has developed. All recommending raw foods.
But - two of these branches fell in the trap of long-term 100% all-plant diets.
One of those branches equates the ideal diet with veganism (ANHS/NHA - started in the 1930's), another branch says that fruitarianism is the ideal (HLI - influenced by TC Fry & A. Ehret).
The remaining 2 branches (e.g. INHS) always recommended some animal foods (as vegetarianism or omnivorism), since the 1950's.
So, only part of Natural Hygiene is responsible for the current situation.
Because of the many books, websites and videos produced over time in these branches of NH, recommending 100% all-plant diets and telling people to avoid animal foods completely - and with the message spreading - we have this unfortunate situation today:
Many people do uncritically believe in the vegan/fruitarian message, practice it, and then get surprised and may panic when something goes wrong.
Many hygienists have known about this ERROR IN (2 branches of) HYGIENE since the 1950's, perhaps from getting in health trouble themselves - but the error is still alive & well.
(Why? Does veganism have a religious quality to it?)
That's why we in INHS are warning once again, with the below email example.
Also, read more about THE CASE AGAINST VEGANISM on INHS website.
WHEN/IF IN TROUBLE - WHAT SHOULD WE DO NEXT?
1. The first question raised here is: why can it be so dangerous? How come serious mineral deficiencies AS WELL AS serious toxic mineral excesses resulted? Why serious yeast problems? Why so many problems?
We made a short interview with Dr. Bass, who is the Natural Hygiene doctor who has been most active, for decades, warning about known consequences of "strict & long-term" veganism and fruitarianism. (Short-term is fine.)
2. The second question that is raised is - how can a person, who got in serious trouble from long-term fruitarianism/veganism, recover?
a. Must we consult with medical doctors?
b. Must the recovery go over cooked foods and supplements?
c. Or is this better: another raw diet, an better, more adequate raw diet?
Dr. Bass answers these questions in the audio.
3. The most important question is: what should they have done instead?
What should vegans/fruitarians do, when/if they get in deficiency-trouble? (On all-raw diets or not.) What should they not do?
We will write more about this in another article.
Here the interview with Dr. Bass (6-08) follows as a mp3 audio file. (Sorry, the quality is not optimal.)
Sooner or later we may present it as text as well.
OUR JOURNEY TO RAW AND BACK
from INHS email list member
5/31/2008 9:28 AM (YahooGroups/inhs)
I haven't visited this forum in eons, and I just checked in briefly to
see what's going on currently in the raw world. I'm happy to see some
discussion on the safety of the raw diet.
I thought I'd share my
experiences to add an additional perspective.
I was a raw foodist for several years. I first learned about raw foods
while on a 2 week semi-fast (the Master Cleanse) and jumped right into
a 100% raw diet (very gourmet in the early months and moved to a
80-10-10 raw vegan diet following Doug Graham's approach. I felt
awesome for 6 months, then ate an average cooked meal. I then
experienced major food addictions for the first time in my life.
next 2 years I was about 80% raw, but it was a constant struggle. In
this time, my children's diets changed radically to a mostly raw
fruitarian diet. They were both under 7 at the time.
But things got progressively worse for all of us. The children kept
getting anemic in spite of all my best raw efforts.
Then they started
to exhibit symptoms of ADHD, Aspergers, and Tourettes (all in the
autism-spectrum) along with various other physical, mental & emotional
difficulties. I too have felt myself going downhill with many symptoms
similar to the children -- problems with memory, focus, eyesight,
fatigue, heat & hydration regulation, anger control, mental fog,
overwhelm etc. It's been scary -- feels like I'm losing myself.
We've seen doctors (naturally-oriented doctors who I trust) and have
had quite a few blood and hair tests. Very enlightning. A "Hair
Elements" test can be ordered from Doctor's Data without a doctor's
involvement through Direct Laboratory Services for around $100 (or
less if my memory serves me). With this, I discovered that we are all
quite deficient in the following trace minerals: calcium, magnesium,
manganese, molybdenum, iodine, lithium, cobalt, and germanium. My
doctor has also determined through other tests and assessments that we
are low in the B vitamins, vitamin D (mine is "off-the-chart" low),
and essential fatty acids. While calcium & protein is low, this is
likely a result of the other deficiencies.
I now realize, that for us, fruit, (previously 80% of our diet) has
created a HUGE yeast problem which we are struggling to get under
control. We went on the Specific Carbohydrate Diet (SCD), used with
great effect to control and even reverse autism-spectrum disorders. It
was not easy to do, as it meant removing everything that could feed
the yeast in digestively impaired people.
This of course meant eliminating all sugars and starch/grains (weren't
eating anyway), but also removing all fruits and raw veggies in the
early stages. It meant getting nutrients from chicken broth and cooked
veggies the first few days and adding new cooked foods one at a time
to see if that particular food was tolerable. Though it meant
swallowing my pride and admitting that the raw life may not be the
"be-all-end-all", this diet was the beginning of our recovery. We
still don't eat sugars or grains/legumes and we've now worked up to
being able to digest most cooked and raw fruits & veggies (raw being
harder for us to digest). And we now eat eggs, butter and meat. In
fact, I love it. I honor it and the animal that has produced it or
given its life. I feel nourished by it. But we are not yet well and
are still struggling to get our digestive system back on track.
We are lactose/casein intolerant and can only eat very limited amounts
of dairy (we make 24 hour cultured yogurt from raw organic milk to
rebuild our intestinal flora). Our symptoms are worse when we eat more
than a bit of fruit or any of the fruits or veggies which have even a
moderate amount of phenols (which we don't digest well). We can only
manage to digest limited amounts of sulphur foods (such as onions
which give much needed flavor to a bland diet).
We do better if we take digestive enzymes before each meal to help to
digest the carbohydrates in fruits/veggies, proteins/fats in all
foods, and the phenols. My children can't get to sleep at night
(laying awake 3-5 hours) unless they take Melatonin (which a normal
healthy body produces naturally). We have to take tons of supplements
just to manage our symptoms (something I'd previously preached
against). But, we are seeing improvements.
The most recent discovery was my low vitamin D. At my doctor's
insistence, I took 12 tablets of 50,000IU prescription VitD over the
course of 12 days. By the end of day 10, a window opened and my mental
fog lifted for the first time in years. I felt capable again--starting
knocking off tasks. Then a few days after I finished it, the fog
descended. I'm waiting to be retested to see if I can PLEASE take some
more (someone who'd sworn off "drugs" for life).
So, what's happened? I'm not blaming all this entirely on our raw diet
and I don't want to discount the glowing testimonials of other healthy
raw foodists. I'm still attached to raw food living as an ideal. Just
one I'm necessarily not living right now, and one I probably won't
return to anytime soon.
I'm going to the trouble to write this because
there are others like us out there who desperately need someone to
figure this out--because I feel like my life is at risk right now.
I've managed to put our decline on hold, but it's a temporary fix
supported artificially by getting our nutrients from a bottle and from
eating a very controlled, contrived diet to avoid anything that causes
trouble. We need to get our digestive system working again, and we
need other "raw experts" to let go of their pride and consider that
maybe for SOME people, a raw diet (or an incorrect raw diet) makes
Now, for my theories. Along with our mineral deficiencies, our hair
tests gave an indication of our toxicities-- a moderate level of
aluminum & arsenic. Not really beyond the range of the toxicities many
people carry, but our total toxicity/deficiency profile indicates
there MAY be some mercury toxicity as well (but there is no accurate
test of this). Mercury is known for interfering with mineral
transport. So, in other words, though we may technically have been
getting enough nutrients, mercury can prevent its uptake. It can also
make it very difficult to maintain a proper balance of intestinal
flora so yeast can get out of control. Yeast overgrowth contributes to
malabsorption and susceptibility to viruses and parasites. Yeast can
apparently mutate to feed off of fruits.
Aha, so maybe it was just the mercury! However, why did things get SO
MUCH WORSE after our raw diet? There were no new amalgams or
immunizations. In fact, my children had never had amalgams and mine
were removed many years previously. We'd never had any real digestion
problems and we were basically active and healthy.
I'm my search for answers to Autism-Spectrum disorders, I came across
the writings of Andrew Cutler, who wrote, "Amalgam Illness: Diagnosis
& Treatment" and "Hair Test Interpretation: Finding Hidden
Toxicities". It's a very complicated topic, but as I read about the
symptoms associated with various toxicities and deficiencies I saw how
many of them fit the pattern of other vegans and raw foodists I knew
who were having trouble.
Turns out it is VERY difficult to remove mercury through natural means
and Dr. Cutler feels strongly that many people do greater damage by
partly detoxing and stirring up mercury that was previously tucked
away in a relatively safe place, bringing it back into circulation.
But because it can't effectively exit the body, it ends up crossing
the blood-brain barrier and is responsible for far worse symptoms. He
(and others) has strong evidence that it is this type of toxic picture
that is the underlying cause for Autism-Spectrum disorders.
So, I have 2 main theories. One is that our raw diet partly detoxed us
and redistributed pre-existing mercury which led to our digestive
decline. We are looking into this and once we bring our yeast under
control, we will consider chelation.
But we are clearly a unique case for our doctors. We are not
responding to the supplements and dietary improvements as well as most
people who following this approach. Our digestive system just doesn't
seem ready to respond.
This leads me to my second theory. That our raw diet, through a lack
of adequate essential fatty acids from animal products (and yes, we
did eat lots of coconuts), vitamins, and minerals created deficiencies
so low that our body's natural ability to synthesis nutrients,
maintain proper blood chemistry and detox through the normal route
have become severely impaired. It's a bit of a chicken and egg issue.
These factors clearly are related, but it's still unclear as to what
the most causative factors are.
As a mother with a challenging situation and very little computer
time, I likely will not respond to questions or dialog. I present this
"case study" only to help facilitate healthy dialog on diet as it
relates to health for ALL people. And as far as the advice I've heard
that we should have water fasted our toxins out, very few mothers
would do this to their children (and some would be arrested for trying).
Note: INHS has been warning about fruitarianism/veganism from our start.
Please speak out!
We encourage everybody who has gotten into trouble from fruitarianism and veganism to speak out!
You can email us at email@example.com
More statistics would be valuable - what percentage get in trouble, in what time-frame, with what strictness (%vegan, % fruit, % raw, etc.)? Plus, the more who tell their got-in-trouble-story, the faster we can stop others from getting in trouble. Also - we encourage every vegan and fruitarian to be as strict as possible -- follow the directions (in whatever vegan/fruitarian book you use) exactly ---because the stricter you are, the sooner you will see the problems.
Those who are strict will discover deficiencies and toxicities quicker. One example is the Westbrook family, who were religiously strict vegans, and started breaking down in less than 6 years. Read about it here: CRASHING ON THE HALLELUJAH DIET
Why are there such differences in breakdown time?
Those who are vegans but cheat (=eat a little animal foods on occasion) can go on for years or decades.
Those who have large reserves when they start (e.g. are young healthy men), & do heavy exercise (which burns away fruit sugars) - they will make it for a longer time.
Children are always being damaged much sooner than adults.
Read more about THE CASE AGAINST VEGANISM
"I'm going to the trouble to write this because there are others like us out there who desperately need someone to figure this out--because I feel like my life is at risk right now. "
THE VEGAN HEALTH PROBLEM SURVEY
- the Westbrooks developed a survey to identifiy the most common problems Hallelujah followers developed on the recommended vegan diet.
- 54 different health problems were identified
- at first, the failing health of those on the diet typically collided with a strong belief in the theory.
- the vegan Hallelujah diet is now judged adequate for 3 months use only
Quote: "But, as our own health problems became overwhelming, we began to sit up and take notice.
Being a scientist at heart (an electrical engineer for 30+ years), I wanted to get a handle on the scope of the problem. So, we created a survey.
So far, we have identified the most common fifty-four health problems people have developed on the Genesis 1:29 Diet, and have incorporated these symptoms into the survey."
THE MOST COMMON PROBLEMS ON THE VEGAN DIET:
Symptom with Reported Percentage
Scattered or foggy thinking 67 (%)
Cravings for cheese, other dairy and/or nuts 62
Don't feel like exercising or working 60
Lack of stamina, endurance and strength 60
Plagued with food cravings 60
Eating lots of fruit or breads 60
Dry skin 58
Loss of muscles and muscle tone 56
Difficulty staying warm 55
Adding supplements to your diet 55
Memory loss 55
Constantly snacking, never satisfied 51
Low tolerance to stress 51
Ridged fingernails and/or thin fingernails 49
Losing look and glow of health: pale skin, dull hair and eyes 45
Food drags you down rather than picks you up 45
Hair loss 44 (%)
Joint pain 44
Slumping posture 44
Negative thinking 44
Mood swings 40
Dry, burning eyes 38
Inability to concentrate 38
Trouble coping with certain food combinations 38
Lack of motivation for daily tasks 36
Eating less, but no weight loss (common in women) 36
Snacking on nuts constantly 35
Headaches, neckaches and/or shoulder pain 33
Salt cravings (sign of adrenal fatigue) 33
Unable to digest food quickly 33
Run down, chronically tired 31
Diminished sex drive 29
Cravings for meat 29 (%)
Look older than should 27
White spots on skin (or loss of skin color) 25
Leg or foot cramps 25
Skinny neck, arms, or legs 24
Heartbeat irregularities 24
Blood pressure too high or too low 24
Whites of the eyes becoming yellow or bloodshot 18
Excessive dental cavities 18
Low thyroid 15
Bleeding gums 15
Too skinny, can't put on weight (common in men) 13
Panic attacks, paranoia 11
Tooth loss 11
Retarded growth (too small for their age) 2
Retarded mental development 2
Neck muscles atrophied to the point that they were only pencil thin:
Read more about the (Hallelujah Genesis) Diet Survey by Greg Westbrook
THE CASE AGAINST VEGANISM